澳大利亞作家Brian Castro答譯者問：閱讀、理論、寫作、疫情

按：澳大利亞作家Brian Castro（中文名字高博文）近日接受其長篇小說《園書》中文譯者之一的馬麗莉教授郵件訪問，內容涉及作家的理論認同和寫作主題等，並有對於此次新冠疫情的回應，還回答了編輯韓松的幾個問題。書店故事現將問答全文發佈，並附作者部分作品書照，希望讀者藉此更多地瞭解這位作家，瞭解澳大利亞文學，以及書稿背後的譯者。

作家2018年作品Blindness and Rage: A Phantasmagoria所獲總理文學獎截圖，from The Adelaide Review

馬麗莉（和白文革——編注）不但在2018年翻譯出版了澳大利亞有華人血統的著名作家布萊恩·卡斯特羅的《園書》（The Garden Book），還在《河北師範大學學報》（哲學社會科學版）2019年第6期發表了《試論〈園書〉的反種族主義主題》（馬麗莉和李靜菲——編注）。這篇文章通過對小說的研究，指出種族主義者的自我仇恨、白人至上的權力關係、白澳政策的陰魂不散是種族主義的主要根源。

——著名澳大利亞文學翻譯家李堯《二〇一九年澳大利亞文學及其在中國的譯介：多元文化語境下的澳大利亞文學》

澳大利亞作家Brian Castro

澳大利亞作家Brian Castro，2018年《園書》由花山文藝出版社在中國大陸出版，其新作Street to Street（《詩人之死》）即將譯出。本文是Mr.Castro 與《園書》譯者之一馬麗莉（另一位譯者是白文革）的答問記錄，編輯韓松也有所提問。

A:

Brian CastroBrian Castro was born in Hong Kong in 1950 of Portuguese, Chinese and English parentage. In 2003 Giramondo published his Shanghai Dancing, which won the Vance Palmer Prize for Fiction, the Christina Stead Prize for Fiction and the NSW Premier’s Book of the Year Award, and his most recent novel, The Garden Book (2005) was shortlisted for the Miles Franklin Award and won the Queensland Premier’s Award for Fiction. Brian Castro is Chair of Creative Writing at the University of Adelaide. Now he lives in the Adelaide Hills outside of Adelaide.

布賴恩·卡斯特羅（Brian Castro，中文名高博文）澳大利亞華裔小說家，出生於1950年，父親是葡萄牙人，母親是中英混血兒。卡斯特羅從小在香港長大，會說廣東話、英語、法語等多種語言。迄今為止，他一共創作小說十餘部、文學評論一部，曾多次獲澳大利亞的各種獎項，其中2018年在中國出版的《園書》獲澳大利亞澳中文學理事會翻譯獎。卡斯特羅是澳大利亞阿德萊德大學創意寫作系主任。現住在阿德萊德郊外的阿德萊德山。

Q：

馬麗莉（Lili）：河北師範大學外國語學院教授，博士，碩士生導師。1991年畢業於河北大學外文系，獲文學碩士學位，1991年—1995年在河北師範學院外國語學院任教，1995—1999年在澳大利亞詹姆斯·庫克大學攻讀澳洲文學，獲文學博士學位，研究方向以澳大利亞文學為主。著有《衝突與契合：澳大利亞文學中的中國婦女形象》（河北大學出版社，2005），主要譯著有《敘事的虛構性：有關歷史、文學和理論的論文（1957-2007）》（合譯，南京大學出版社，2019），《園書》（合譯，花山文藝出版社，2018）。

韓松（Han Song）：圖書編輯，曾任《園書》中文版編輯之一（責任編輯：梁東方 韓松）。

Questions from Lili

Q1. Have you been influenced by any Cosmopolitan theory? Who is the most influential theorist or philosopher to you in becoming or adopting a Cosmopolitan position to write?

您曾受世界主義理論的影響嗎？如果有，哪位理論家或哲學家對您採取世界主義視角來寫作影響最大？

A1. No, I have never been influenced by any theory.

沒有，我不曾被任何一種理論所影響。

Q2. Would you agree if I say that there is a consistent theme through all your books, that is Cosmopolitanism?

您是否認同我的觀點，即在您全部作品中，有一個一以貫之的主題，即世界主義？A2.Not really. It seems to me that cosmopolitanism was about European large cities in the 19th and 20th centuries and I`ve always been more provincial in the best sense of that term，living outside big cities and in the country.並非如此。在我看來，世界主義是關於19到20世紀的歐洲大城市，從這個詞的最好意義上說，我一直更鄉村，我更多地會選擇居住在大城市以外，住在鄉村。

Q3.What do you think of this quotation? “Some people think that a cosmopolitan is someone who is “worldly” and therefore comfortable— at home— everywhere. I prefer to think of the cosmopolitan as someone who is “worldly” and therefore not fully comfortable— never fully at home— anywhere. Being cosmopolitan means knowing how to make a virtue out of discomfort; it means cultivating comfort and discomfort simultaneously”(from Cosmopolitanism and the Literary Imagination by Cyrus R. K. Patell，New York，PALGRAVE MACMILLAN，2015）.

你是否同意以下引文？“有些人認為世界主義者是指那些‘見多識廣’的人，因此在任何地方都能舒適自在。我更願意把世界主義者想成是一個‘世俗’的人，因此在任何地方都不會感到完全舒適，也不會完全自在。世界主義者意味著知道如何合理地利用不舒適並把它變成優點；它意味著同時培養舒適和不適”（引自Cosmopolitanism and the Literary Imagination by Cyrus R. K. Patell，New York，PALGRAVE MACMILLAN，2015.）

A3. Yes, I would not be at home anywhere, because the idea of "home" is a relative one.All you need is one incident to make you doubt the concept of home.For instance, I was once described as a "Tricky Chinaman".Although I have never worried about these racist remarks,I also did not subscribe to the fact that since I was not born in Australia,there will always be these slurs against me,which are just under the surface.I remain positive.The recent COVID19 VIRUS created new incidents.People saw me in the supermarket and turned around quickly.That`s fine with me.

同意。我到哪裡都不會自在，因為“自在”是一個相對概念。只需發生一件小事，你就會感到不自在。比如，我曾經被描述為“狡猾的中國佬”。儘管我從未擔心過這些種族主義言論，但我也不認同這一事實，因為我並非在澳大利亞出生，但總會有一些針對我的詆譭，哪怕這些詆譭只是在心裡。我保持積極的心態。最近的新冠狀病毒製造了新的事件。人們在超市看到我，會很快轉過身去。我對此並不在意。

Q4. What is the significance of writing a story on Richard Sorge who was a German spy for Russia, living in Japan—Stepper?

《斯苔伯》寫的是關於理查德·佐爾格（Richard Sorge）這位曾經生活在日本的、為斯大林刺探情報的德國間諜，您寫這本書有什麼重要含義嗎？

A4. Well he was never at home. His loyalties were ideological,not sentimental. 有，他從未有過自在感。他的忠誠是意識形態的，卻非情感層面的。

Q5. Do you have religion in mind when writing The Garden Book? I am asking because I remember two incidents: one is you write about Moses breaks the Tablet; the other is you have said that Garden represents Eden, and from the ending of the book where you do mention God, can we infer that the fall of humans start at the Eden time, it also echos Auden’s poem at the very beginning of the book”？ Do you mean to hint: return to Eden is the ultimate redemption of human beings？

您在寫《園書》時是否想到了宗教？我如此問是因為我記得讀到兩個事件：一是關於摩西摔法版，二是書的結尾處您提到伊甸園，上帝，我們是否可以推論：人的墮落始於伊甸園，這一點是否呼應書的開頭奧登的詩句？書的結尾是否暗示“重歸伊甸園是否可以成為人類最後的希望和救贖”？

A5.No I Have never been religious at all. Going to a catholic boarding school drummed that out of me. The quote from Auden is ironic.What you think is Eden is really an illusion.While I understand that religion is a comfort to people in times of need,in more secure times it sometimes is a crutch.

並非如此。我從未有過宗教信仰。上天主教的寄宿學校讓我徹底離開了宗教。引用奧登的詩句有諷刺意義。你所認為的伊甸園其實是一種幻覺。我理解宗教是人們在需要時的安慰，但在更安全的時候，它有時是一個支柱。

Q6 Can I say that the very beginning and the end echo each other in saying that the cost of human fall in Eden is their permanent exile?

我是否可以說書的開始和結尾都呼應了人類在伊甸園墮落的代價就是他們永遠的放逐？

A6.Yes, very much.

可以，的確如此。

Questions from Han Song

Q1.Hello, Mr. Castro. I know that you were born in 1950. I want to know which year did you start writing? Could you please tell us something about the source of your literary creation over the years? In other words, what do you think is the important quality for a writer to write a good work?

您好，卡斯特羅先生，我知您是1950年出生，您是何時開始寫作的呢？對您這些年的創作，可否請您說說您的創作源泉？或者說，您認為對於一位作家，要寫出好作品，什麼比較重要。

A1. I started writing when I was in school. I.E. About 15 or 16. I was very depressed since my parents were in the Hong Kong and I never went home. I first won a prize at Sydney University with my short story Estrellita. Since then I have always been blessed in the sense that winning prizes is the opposite of selling well. Without prizes I would be unknown.People got to know my work through the prizes.The source of my creation is various:sadness,love,memory and appreciation. In other words,it is emotional to a degree,never theoretical.

我從大約是十五六歲，在上學時開始寫作。我有一段低沉期，那時我的父母在香港生活而我從不回家。我在悉尼大學第一次獲獎，是因短篇《艾斯特莉塔》。從那時起，我一直很幸運，我頻頻獲獎，而獲獎與銷售業績正好相反。沒有獲獎，我將默默無聞。人們通過我的得獎而知道我的作品。我的創作源泉多種多樣：悲傷，愛情，記憶，和感恩。換句話說，創作源泉從某種程度講是情感，從來不是理論。

Q2. What do you think reading means for writing novels, especially reading novels?

您認為閱讀對創作小說的意義是怎樣的，尤其是閱讀小說。

A2. Reading is the most important thing. One can not write out of a vacuum.You have in your head and then you start to absorb them and then after that you find your own style.

閱讀是最重要的事情。人不能憑空而寫。你在頭腦裡孕育，然後你開始吸收它們，再後你會找到自己的寫作風格。

Q3. Haruki Murakami(村上春樹) from Japan was born in 1949, do you read his works?Do you read modern Chinese （1912— ）writers?If yes, could you tell me which Chinese writers you like best and why?

日本的村上春樹是1949年出生，您讀他的作品嗎？您讀現代（modern）中國作家的作品嗎？如果有讀，可否請您談談您最喜歡哪位/哪幾位中國作家，以及為何喜歡。

A3.I don’t read Murakami because I actually don’t bond with his style.The Chinese writers I like best are Han Shaogong.Who has been a great inspiration to me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Dictionary_of_Maqiao

And Lu Xun’s short stories.I am less inspired by modern or contemporary writers.The test of time is the greatest test.

我不讀村上春樹，因為我實際上與他的風格聯繫不大。中國作家，我最喜歡韓少功，他給了我重要的啟迪。我還喜歡魯迅的短篇。

我對現當代作家關注得較少。經得起時間的檢驗才是偉大的作品。

Q4.Could you talk about your writing in the past year? For example, what books have you written and what are your writing plans for this year? Will you plan to write have prose in the future ?

可否談一下您2019年的寫作情況？比如，寫了什麼書，以及2020年有怎樣的寫作計劃？是否有散文集方面的寫作計劃？

A4.I am in the process of writing a series of short stories.It is funny but I started as a short story writer.I like the form since I don`t like novels that are too long and dragged out.I enjoy the short piece of writing.It frees me up.It tells the truth much better in different voices.

我在寫一系列的短篇故事。聽上去有點可笑，但我是以寫短篇開始的。從我不再喜歡冗長的小說開始，我喜歡上短篇的形式。我喜歡片段地寫，這讓我自由。它能用更多不同的聲音來呈現真實。

Q5.Could I know which city do you live in? How has the coronavirus outbreak affected the lives of people in your city? With more than one million people infected globally, would you consider reflecting on this epidemic in your writing?

您在哪座城市生活？冠狀病毒疫情對您所在的城市居民的生活有何影響？現在全球感染人數超100萬人，您會考慮在創作過程裡體現相關思考嗎？

A5.I live in the Adelaide Hills outside of Adelaide.As I said before,I do not like big cities. I like the country.The virus has not reached me，thank goodness. I don`t go out very much,except I ride my bicycle through the countryside.Yes，my short story book is dealing with the epidemic.Remember that Boccaccio did the same thing during the time of the great plague(1348). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decameron

我住在阿德萊德郊外的阿德萊德山。我之前說過，我不喜歡大城市。我喜歡鄉下。謝天謝地，病毒沒有影響到我。除了騎自行車在鄉間兜風我很少出門。是的，我的短篇小說是關於流行病毒的。薄伽丘在大瘟疫時期也做了同樣的事情（1348）。https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decameron

Q6

.I hope to publish your collected works in China. Thank you.

我希望能在中國出版您的著作集，謝謝您。

A6.Thank you so much. I appreciate your interest in my work and also Lili`s faith in it to disseminate it to Chinese readers.Thank you once again.

謝謝你。感謝你對我作品感興趣，也感謝麗莉有信心將我的作品傳播給中國讀者。再次感謝你們。

澳大利亞作家Brian Castro

作家所在城市阿德萊德的動漫中心（Adelaide Comic Centre），這裡有不少動漫圖書

Books written by Brian Castro(portion)

Shanghai Dancing

Shanghai Dancing作者: Brian Castro出版社: Kaya Pres出版年: 2009定價: $18.95

裝幀: PaperbackISBN: 9781885030429

《上海舞》

《上海舞》作者: 布賴恩·卡斯特羅出版社: 上海譯文出版社譯者: 王光林出版年: 2010-10頁數: 420定價: 35.00元叢書: 當代澳大利亞小說譯叢ISBN: 9787532751860

《上海舞》是澳大利亞華裔作家布賴恩·卡斯特羅的一部虛構性自傳作品。作品的敘述者名叫安東尼奧·卡斯特羅，在澳大利亞生活了40多年，後來，他決定離開澳大利亞，於是借道香港，也就是他出生的地方，乘船返回上海。在上海，他遇見了攝影師吳凱鳴，在她的幫助下，他們一起翻閱著那些老照片，回憶起過去的一個個鏡頭。卡斯特羅通過蒙太奇般的跳躍式敘述，講述了他的家族故事，或者說他的家族在上海的來回跳舞。敘述者的故事主要發生在第二次世界大戰前後的上海，澳門和香港。但是通過想象，敘述者將故事一直追溯到了彼此相連的各個帝國，從17世紀的巴西，前葡萄牙殖民地果阿，長崎，菲律賓，利物浦，再到巴黎，包括1997年英國從香港的撤離和他在澳大利亞的複雜生活等。在這錯綜複雜的敘述中，讀者們讀到了他們家一代代的家族故事，各種各樣的秘密，鴉片，小妾，沉默寡言的母親，放蕩不羈的父親，各種賭徒，三合會成員，情人，孤兒，等等。小說打破了傳統的自傳形式，呈現出多元主題。

據《東方早報》，布賴恩·卡斯特羅的父親是葡萄牙人，母親是中國香港人，布賴恩·卡斯特羅有著一頭黑髮和灰藍色眼睛，會說廣東話、英語、法語。他出生於香港，11歲時即赴澳大利亞學習、生活。

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After China2003

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THE BATH FUGUE

THE BATH FUGUE

作者: Brian Castro出版社: Giramondo Publishing出版年: 2009-5頁數: 374定價: $29.95裝幀: PaperbackISBN: 9781920882556

The Bath Fugues is Castro at his best, in a wonderful performance wrought from intrigue, romance, deception – and comedy. The book is composed of three interwoven novellas, the first centred on an ageing art forger; the second on a Portuguese poet, opium addict and collector; the third told by a well-connected doctor, with a cabinet of venom, and an art gallery on the north Queensland coast.Around these characters circle others, in the contrapuntal manner of the fugue suggested by the book’s title. Some are related, some fugitive, some like the essayist Montaigne, the poet Baudelaire or the philosopher Benjamin, enter the story from the past.Motifs recur – baths, bicycles, clocks, addiction, the counterfeit – deepening the lines of association and inheritance which bind their lives, and giving weight to the friendships thrust upon them.

澳門歲月

澳門歲月

Birds of Passage

Birds of Passage

作者: Castro,Brian出版社: Sirus Press出版年: 1983頁數: 157裝幀: 平裝ISBN: 9780207161483

Birds of Passage (originally titled Solitude) is Castro's first novel and is the joint winner (with Nigel Krauth) of The Australian/Vogel Literary Award. It interweaves two narratives, that of a Chinese Lo Yun Shan who comes to Australia from Kwangtung (Guangdong) in the 1850s gold rushes, and a contemporary Australian, Seamus O'Young, who is of Chinese descent. Seamus discovers an old journal written by Shan, and as he translates this journal his own life becomes increasingly entwined with that of Shan. Just as Shan was driven from the goldfields by depravity, racism and sheer greed (of Australian whites), so Seamus finds himself, a century later, fighting for his own life and sanity. This novel investigates questions of identity, specifically in terms of "translation" between cultures. Our selection is taken from the first chapter of the novel with some adaptation. Castro's postmodern style of writing enables him to travel in time and space in depicting his characters and conveying the themes of his novels.

候鳥·縈繫中國

作者: 布賴恩·卡斯特羅出版社: 青島出版社譯者: 李堯叢書: 李堯譯文集ISBN: 9787555263715

本書為布萊恩·卡斯特羅兩部作品的合集。《候鳥》是作者影響最大的作品，以兩條平行的線索，通過戲仿的手法，表現了早期華裔移民在澳大利亞的生存經歷以及主人公的文化認同困惑。《縈繫中國》是作者以魔幻現實主義的手法，將中國古代的哲人老子、風流倜儻的才子唐寅和現實生活中光怪陸離的人物以及他們的命運交織在一起，在澳大利亞廣袤的土地上演繹出一個生動美麗的愛情故事。

The Garden Book

The Garden Book 作者: Brian Castro

《園書》

《園書》

出版社: 花山文藝出版社

原作名: The Garden Book

譯者: 馬麗莉 白文革

出版年: 2018-6

頁數: 262定價: 28.00元裝幀: 平裝ISBN: 9787551137904

Street to Street（中文版正在翻譯）

Street to Street（中文版正在翻譯）作者: Brian Castro頁數: 184ISBN: 978145964919

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作者: Brian Castro
出版年：2018

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