Are we overrating the Lakers young talent?
我們高估湖人這幫年輕人的天賦了嗎？
I see a lot of Lakers fans saying that Ingram/Kuzma/Hart/Ball are not worth trading for any star this year. But every time I watch them play all I see is guys getting their stats but not playing winning basketball. How can all these young guys have this much hype and not produce a winning product on the floor with the best basketball player in the world?
我看到很多湖蜜說，英格拉姆、庫茲馬、哈特和鮑爾這個賽季已經不具備交易任何球星的價值。我每次看他們打球的時候，我只知道他們雖然都能刷數據，但打得並不是勝利籃球。這幫球員受到這麼多熱捧，並且還和世界最佳籃球運動員並肩戰鬥，那他們怎麼就不能在場上為球隊帶來勝利呢？
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[–]Thunder nuhx 2045 points 13 hours ago
Young talent in general is really overrated in the NBA. NBA fans rate young players more about what they ideally can be than what they actually are right now. They are always assuming the young talent will improve consistently year by year under ideal circumstances.
雷霆球迷：大體而言，年輕人的天賦在NBA都是被高估的。NBA球迷對年輕人進行評價時更多地是依據他們今後理想的發展前景，而並非他們當下真正的實力。在某種理想化的設定下，大家總是覺得有天賦的年輕人會年復一年地持續進步。
[–][CLE] LeBron James Scatteredbrain 115 points 11 hours ago
yea like BI turning into Durant
騎士球迷：是的，就好比說英格拉姆成長為杜蘭特。
[–][GSW] Draymond Green jthc 115 points 10 hours ago
He’s got the body of Durant, but not the shot. And Durant was a great shooter before he even got to the NBA.
勇士球迷：他有阿杜的身材，但是沒有他的投籃。小帥進入NBA之前就已經是一名出色的投手了。
[–]Celtics gampo 57 points 8 hours ago
Also, Durant has a really fluid handle. BI isn't close to that.
凱爾特人氣密：而且阿杜的控球真的很流暢，英格拉姆還差得遠啊。
[–]Sullan 08 45 points 5 hours ago
Also just better at literally everything else lol. Ingram is massively overrated as a future star.
小帥其他各方面同樣都比英格拉姆強。說啥英格拉姆是未來的球星，他真的被嚴重高估了。
[–]Spurs kawhi_tho 74 points 9 hours ago
Michael Lewis talked about this in Moneyball. Scouts love young guys because they can imagine them growing up to be anything. It's harder to do that with a 30 year old.
馬刺球迷：邁克爾-劉易斯（美國當代報告文學作家、財經記者）在《點球成金》一書中說過這點。那些球探們喜歡年輕球員，是因為他們可以設想那些年輕人今後的任何可能性。要是去預想一個30歲球員的未來的話，那就難多了。
[–]BubbaTee 43 points 8 hours ago
Of course I'll trade (Player) for a draft pick. A draft pick could be anything! it could even be the next (Player)!
要是我也會用球員去換一個選秀權。畢竟一個選秀權包含任何可能性！甚至可能是下一個球星！
[–]Spurs kawhi_tho 48 points 6 hours ago
This is why the Lakers fans who thought Ingram had as much trade value as Kawhi were being stupid. Best-case scenario, Ingram turns out to be Kawhi. Kawhi already is Kawhi.
馬刺球迷：所以說，那些覺得英格拉姆的交易價值等同於卡哇伊的湖蜜是愚蠢的。即便是最理想的情況下，英格拉姆成了卡哇伊那種球員，可是卡哇伊現在已經是這個水準了。
[–]Lakers eldencampbell 23 points 8 hours ago
Young talent is always overrated but young Lakers talent is particularly overrated.
Kuzma is the only young Laker who plays with urgency on offense. He puts more pressure than Ingram on the defense because he makes his move/decision immediately. He's a good finisher too.
Lonzo plays like you're not allowed to dribble more than 3 times. He isn't even testing that whole other dimension of passing that opens up through individual playmaking. It worries me.
I honestly don't know what to make of Ingram. If we was a better shooter I could believe in the whole narrative of him still being so young/promising.
湖人球迷：有天賦的年輕人通常是被高估的，不過湖人隊裡有天賦的年輕人尤甚。
庫茲馬是湖人隊裡唯一在進攻端打出緊迫感的年輕人。他在防守端施加的壓力也比英格拉姆多，因為他能瞬間做出移動/決策。他還是個很優秀的終結者。
鮑爾就打得像是教練不允許他運球超過3次一樣。這可真叫我著急啊。
我真不知道怎麼評價英格拉姆。如果他的投籃再強一些的話，那我還能相信那些說他仍然年輕且有前途的坊間言論。
[–]New Jersey Netslatman 55 points 11 hours ago
Jaylen Brown is a perfect example of this. Players almost never develop playmaking/passing skills if they don't show signs of it at a young age.
杰倫-布朗就是個很好的例子。有些球員如果在年輕的時候沒有顯示出組織和傳球的天賦，那他們幾乎是沒法開發出這兩個技能的。
[–][UTA] Dell Curry DeathBySuplex 1069 points 12 hours ago
I blame 2k where players do naturally progress to an assumed peak.
Real world doesn’t work that way.
爵士球迷：這鍋2K得背啊，畢竟遊戲裡的球員都能自然而然地走向既定的巔峰。
現實世界則沒有這麼順暢了。
[–][CHI] Brian Scalabrine CoachDT 119 points 9 hours ago
I get called a hater for telling people this.
Like last year with Lonzo, he definitely CAN progress into an all-NBA type player, he can fix his J, improve at attacking the basket, improve his free throw shooting to become the type of guy to average like 19/11/6.
That doesn't mean you assume thats going to happen and you have to take someone for what they are currently even if "They're only (insert arbitrary age)!". This isn't me hating this is just me stating sometimes you get someone like Giannis that improves pretty consistently every year. Other times you get a Tyreke Evans or MCW. So assuming your young guys will just become stars is a bit silly.
公牛球迷：我因為這麼跟人說被當做噴子。
就像上賽季的鮑爾，他絕對是能夠成長為一名全明星級別的球員的，他可以改善自己的跳投，提升攻筐的能力和罰球，從而成為一名場均19+11+6的球員。
可是這並不意味著你的設想就能成為現實啊，你得參照現實來看待某個球員啊。這不是我噴，我只是陳述觀點，有時候你會碰到字母哥這種每年都進步迅速的球員，其他時候你就會看到埃文斯和邁卡威。所以呢，預想你們隊裡的年輕人會成為球星，這是有點蠢的。
[–]pev2 260 points 11 hours ago
That's exactly what it is. A huge portion of the r/nba subscriber base does not regularly watch basketball. They watch the playoffs and occassional high-profile regular season games .
就是這麼回事。這個專區的很大一部分球迷並不是經常看籃球的。他們看季後賽，偶爾看看高光集錦。
[–][LAL] Pat Riley OBPing 403 points 10 hours ago
I remember back in the days in NBA2K1 when Kwame Brown, Tyson Chandler, Eddy Curry were rookies (yes I’m going waaaay back) the three of them would eventually go on to be the next Duncan, Shaq & Hakeem.
湖人球迷：我還記得當年的2K1，裡面的誇梅-布朗、泰森-錢德勒和埃迪-庫裡都還是菜鳥（沒錯，這都是陳芝麻爛穀子的事兒了），遊戲的設定是他們仨最終分別為成長為下一個鄧肯、奧尼爾和奧拉朱旺。
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[–]Mavericks rvadarocket 277 points 13 hours ago
Yes, there’s talent there, but it’s not like they’ve got multiple young All-Stars just waiting to happen
獨行俠球迷：是的，湖人那幫年輕人確實有天賦，但這並不意味著那幾位小哥能自然成為全明星球員。
[–]Nuggets Wtfitzchris 76 points 10 hours ago*
Completely agree. Their young players aren't bad, but they get overrated because they play for the Lakers. Take Ingram for example. 16/4/1 on 47/33/65 shooting splits is nothing special for a player in his third year, especially when you consider he's below average defensively. I can't help but think that if he played on the Magic or Kings, most casual fans would have already forgotten about him.
完全贊同。湖人的年輕球員是不錯的，但是他們之所以被高估，是因為他們效力於湖人。就拿英格拉姆舉例吧，16+4+1的數據，47%、33%和65%的三項命中率對於一個進入聯盟已三年的球員來說，沒什麼特別的，何況他的防守還在平均水準之下。我就覺得吧，要是他在魔術或者國王的話，大多數路人球迷或許已經忘了他。
[–][CHI] Brian Scalabrine CoachDT 54 points 9 hours ago
He'd be an interesting player, if he played on the magic people would call him a worse Turkuglu or say thats his ceiling.
However he plays in LA so suddenly dude is gonna be the next KD.
公牛球迷：那這個球員就有意思了，要是他為魔術效力的話，大家會叫他窮人版特科格魯，或者說他的上限就是特科格魯。
可是呢，他在洛杉磯啊，所以突然間，這哥們兒倒被吹成了下一個小帥。
[–][LAL] Kobe Bryant Leaootemivel 38 points 8 hours ago
The dude got called a bust endlessly in his rookie year and even last year people were saying that his ceiling was Travis Outlaw.
科比球迷：英格拉姆處子賽季的時候，很多人就沒完沒了地說他是水貨，甚至是上賽季，大家還說他的上限也就是特拉維斯-奧特洛。
[–]Bucks Lanky_Kaleidoscope 128 points 10 hours ago
They have four young players that might not be far from becoming quality starters. Not many teams in the league have that. The Lakers genuinely do have good talent and it is definitely not out of the question one of their young players becomes an all star talent in their prime.
That said, people probably overrate the significance of that. Young talent can be squandered quickly. Once those guys have to be paid, team will have tough decisions to make. And those guys aren't really doing that much more to help team win in short run than fairly average veterans.
Lakers are in good shape as far as young talent goes, but that doesn't mean their team is very good at the moment and it also doesn't mean that they are just gonna have some star studded team when those guys develop. Some could disappoint, some could surprise (more will disappoint probably cause fans are usually over-optimistic about young players), but they all will be expensive to retain.
雄鹿球迷：湖人擁有的這四個年輕人或許很快就能成為那種強力首發球員。聯盟裡有這種年輕財富的球隊可不多。湖人確實有很強的天賦，而且他們這幫年輕人裡面或許有個人會在巔峰期進入全明星呢，這還真不好說啊。
話雖這麼說，大家或許還是高估了其中的重要性。年輕人的天賦是可以很快就揮霍掉的，一旦他們到了簽約的時候，那球隊就面臨著艱難的抉擇了。而且相比起那些一般的老將，這些年輕人在短期內為球隊取勝所做的貢獻實際並沒有多出多少啊。
隨著年輕人的成長，湖人正處於一種積極的態勢下，不過這並不意味著球隊眼下是優秀的，而且這也不能保證當這幫年輕人成長起來之時，湖人就會成為一支星光熠熠的球隊。有些球員會讓人失望，有些則帶給人驚喜，但他們都是需要球隊付出昂貴代價來留下的。
[–]Raptors bloopcity 114 points 12 hours ago
I think we overrate young players in general, unless they are a freak athlete/talent, most young players don't contribute consistently until about 23. Ingram is 21, give them time (unfortunately LeBron doesn't have much of that).
猛龍球迷：我覺得我們通常都會高估年輕人，除非他們是那種變態的天賦或者身體素質，大部分在23歲之前是沒法持續穩定輸出的。英格拉姆才21嘛，給點時間（可惜的是，勒布朗沒有那麼多時間等待）。
[–]Lakers ashishvp 95 points 9 hours ago
That’s honestly the reason why signing Lebron was so weird.
Don’t get me wrong, it’s fucking Lebron and I’m stoked. But hes 34! He really doesn’t fit with our rebuilding timeline.
湖人球迷：所以我才覺得籤勒布朗很奇怪。
別曲解我啊，那可是特麼的勒布朗啊，我很高興的。但是他都34了！他真的不符合我們重建的時間線。
[–]Raptors bloopcity 64 points 9 hours ago
I thought you guys would ship out ingram and/or ball to get an immediate talent and try and keep Randle but this is where we are.
猛龍球迷：我之前還以為你們會送出英格拉姆和/或者球哥，從而得到一名具備即戰力的天賦型球員，然後再試著留下蘭德爾呢，可是事實卻是現在這個樣子。
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[–][UTA] Joe Ingles NitroXYZ 620 points 13 hours ago
Absolutely. If they where on the Magic or Grizzlies they wouldn't get nearly as much attention.
英格爾斯球迷：絕對的。要是他們在魔術或者灰熊的話，他們得到的關注度要比現在少的多啊。
[–]thehumangenius23 146 points 11 hours ago
This shit bothers me. The Lakers young guys still look talented, you can still see the individual talent. But the issue with the Lakers is that they’re not playing well as a team. None of these guys are playing defined roles and the best looking one (Ingram) was suspended for 4 games and missed opportunity to gel with the new line ups.
Lebron is a great player but adding him to the roster has massively changed things, they even started out a little better last year than this year. My issue with the team is Luke still somehow doesn’t know what he has in each player and line up after weeks and weeks of training camps, summer league and games.
Also, it’s noteworthy that a lot of these runs to close deficits come when Lebron is on the bench. He’s not fitting in with the young guys, but he’s damn Lebron so of course you gotta base your play around him.
這種屁話真的煩。湖人的年輕人還是很有天賦的，你還是能看得到他們個人的天賦。但是湖人的問題是這幫年輕人作為一個團隊的表現不甚理想。他們全都沒有明確的角色定位，而且看著最強的那個（英格拉姆）還被停賽四場，錯過了與球隊的新首發磨合的機會。
雖說勒布朗是個偉大的球員，但是引進他已經對球隊造成了鉅變，湖人上賽季的開局甚至還要比這個賽季好點。我覺得球隊的問題在於，經歷過幾周的訓練營、夏季聯賽和比賽過後，沃頓仍然不知道自己對每個球員和這套陣容的安排是什麼。
此外，值得注意的是，很多縮小比賽分差的小高潮都是勒布朗坐在替補席上的時候打出來的，他和這幫年輕人不搭，但誰叫他是特麼的勒布朗呢，你必須得圍繞他打啊。
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編譯：雲長刮個痧
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